Eye Scanner

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:45 pm

Cheers! Good price as well for whites!

But no bulbs yet...

The circuit I'm working on doesn't include LED trailing. I do want it to be able to do so, but might end up making separate circuits for the bulb and LED version.

Post by **mckenic** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:41 pm

Just some vids -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ricvRK6O ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrvbDA9Y ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ce16M6Nn ... re=related

This is interesting because the chap used an Arduino type board taht can be programmed over USB... the fade on the LEDs is really cool -

http://blog.tokash.org/2008/02/16/knigh ... light-bar/

HTH

Dave

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:38 am

Pretty kewl indeed. Downside is that the board alone is 50 euros or more.

It's design is capable of a lot more then a Knight Rider scanner.

Cheers for the links!

Post by **BazookaJo** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 3:04 am

SiR-ROUND wrote:Hi and thanks!

Say, are you the guy that made the papercraft helmet?

Yes I am he

BTW I have done a neckpeice and backpack too if anyone needs any help with constructing their suits.

http://www.bazookajo.me.uk/PaperModels/Cylon/Cylon.htm

I am also close to completing the breastplate, and a fellow cardmodeller has done the sword and belt squares, so keep your eyes open.

Best regards

Paul.

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 3:13 am

It's whopping awesome!

Thanks very much!

I'm exploring other ways to make the circuit work. Choosing a different decoder chip might reduce costs more. Also looked at "Charlieplexing", but I think it would make it more difficult to make the LED's "trail"...

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:04 am

Mkay, need more input.

When I look at the TOS bulb scanner, it looks to me that the bulbs besides a trail (natural afterglow I presumed) they actually have the same "rising" glow as well? Any thoughts on this? The whole thing can ofcourse be obscured by lens filters while filming.

If bulbs would need extra circuitry to give the right effect, it might be possible again to use LED's along side.

Also found a basic circuit design that has 16 outputs and can be doubled. Will use one chip more, but hey, the 32 goal is important too!

Still waiting on the software, can't wait!!!

Website · Post by **Starbuck** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 2:46 pm

The scanners I have built, both for my Knight Rider replicas have used the "Back and fourth Flasher" circuit from the Forrest M.Mims III Engineers notebook copyright 1992, from Radio Shack.
Page 61 shows this circuit that drives 16 L.E.D.s with a 74154 (4line to 16line decoder), this chip is driven by a 74ls193 and 2 Nand gates from a 7400, and finally deliverd clock pulses from a simple 555 timer astable pulser. This is a good smooth circuit with no "stops" at the ends.
It could be easily adapted to drive bulbs with booster transistors on the outputs. These are 1970's chips which are available from Unicorn Electronics for CHEAP. The 74154 is about $3.00 and the 74ls193 about $2.00. The 7400's are about 3 CENTS apiece last time I checked, they also have free shipping for anything over $20.00 minimum order.
these chips are "thru hole" and not surface mount componants, and so I'm not sure if someone could build the circuit small enough to fit into a helmet. I just wanted to let you guys know that it is an EXCELLENT scanner and I ran it on my Red Rider 2000 Knight inspired vehicle 24/7 for several years without ever running the battery down or having any problems with the circuit.

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 2:44 am

Cheers, the main problem is getting the 32 with a minimal increase in components using some tricks. All to save space indeed. The place where Kropserkel places the circuit is a good one. Not easy with many chips.

Furthermore, a very good technique to have the leds act like bulbs (fading) uses up a lot of space using transistors and caps. But it works very well. Might not even be a use for bulbs if the leds are driven this way.

Website · Post by **Starbuck** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:46 pm

I agree Sir-round. The older thru hole chips (even worse if adding circuitry to make L.E.D.s have fade effect) would be hard to make a circuit with that would fit inside a helmet.
I'm sure there are surface mount versions of all the chips necessary to make it, as well as NPN Transistor array surfmount chips, although it might be difficult to find a transistor array chip that could handle the charging current of the caps plus the high current of bulbs.
I'm real good at designing/making thru hole circuits, but not very good at making them small or neat. The stuff I make works, and thats usually good enough for me. After built, I can put them in a box and hide it somewhere and use a nice neat ribbon cable to get to the L.E.D.s or bulbs. I'm pretty good at doing stuff in my Knight replicar, but doing stuff small enough to fit in a cylon helmet would be a challenge for me
If i built my own circuit for a helmet, I would put the circuit in the back pack and have a ribbon cable going into the helmet for the bulbs/L.E.D.s.

I'm sure that no one would want it set up like that, but I wonder if the original bulb circuit on the prop models was set up like that.
I just can't see 1979 cicuitry ALL being mounted in the helmets.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

Post by **SiR-ROUND** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 2:58 am

The original circuit was made up from a couple of layers of PCB if I see right on the archive pics here. And many big chips!

I worked with the bigger chips at school way back. Used to be pretty good in getting the smallest logical PCB, just not a super wiz at designing.

Driving leds through a long long ribbon is okay, but most of the chips can't handle that load, so you need to amplify either way.

And well, pretty sure great results can be made with micro controllers, but I haven't got what it takes for those. Bit of a standstill now, working on my cinema rather than getting frustrated further in Circuit Wizard.

Post by **ChrisPappas** » Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:41 pm

I read through this thread and I thought I'd clear up a few bits of misinformation.

I have replicated the original Cylon eyes, one to one, right down to the last chip and wire, using the same assembly methods as in the originals. I made these to run directly off original Cylon belts as well as power supplies that reproduced the dual power output of the belts.

Anyone that knows the original eyes knows just how hot they run. As time went on, I devised changes to the bulb type and power that would give the exact same brightness and "look" while dramatically reducing the heat and extending the battery life. After this, I offered either option, while recommending the cooler running "AA" battery version. Another option I offered was a "freeze" button to stop the eye sweep.

The price I have charged has increased over the years, but it has never been $2500. The last quote I made a few months ago was for $1500.

A lot of the parts to make the eyes are still readily available, but there are some crucial parts that are no longer manufactured. I've got one set of chips left and after that, any future eyes will have to be completely redesigned using modern components.

As for those who think that you can take a series of $0.10 decade counters and string them together to get the effect, you are mistaken. Getting a bounce circuit to work with 6 LEDs using a decade counter is childs play and will cost you about $5.00 plus your time, but a Cylon eye is much more complicated.

Chris

YouTube · Post by **Cylon-Knight** » Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:24 pm

Cool info Chris. The original bulbs are no doubt cool, but I have zero interest in bulbs for my Cylon. Yes that is "correct" - but - that is only due to the fact that is all they had to work with in the late 70s. That is totally awesome you have the knowledge and skill to copy that - wish I had that know-how.

Bulbs are "correct," however, I don't want to limit my Cylon with what is nothing more than dated technology... HOT light bulbs will burn out quicker than LEDs, big chips, power cord down your neck/back to a battery belt that - if you can find one - is WAY over priced for being 30+ years old (and I iam guessing interesting to Cylon builders, or camen-men/movie production fans only).

1:1 @ $1,500 or $15... sorry, Cylon-Knight passes on bulbs.

I'll be using LEDs, I've even thought of tri-colored LEDs. Wouldn't it be fun to *flip switch* have a green scanner.... or *flip switch* have a blue scanner!

Then - poof - back to red. Could have fun with a green scanner in a local St. Patrick's day parade. LEDs can do amazing things, from Daft Punk helmets to billboards! WOW

1:1 hard core fans save up and buy one of the few "real" Cylon suits that still exist. That's the only way you'll ever get EXACTLY - 100% screen accurate. AND when you buy one, I'll be your best friend

P.S. Chris, Welcome to the club - post often and enjoy. Share some photos of your Cylon when you have the time. Love to see what everyone is up to.

YouTube · Post by **Cylon-Knight** » Sat Nov 21, 2009 8:56 pm

ChrisPappas wrote:I have replicated the original Cylon eyes, one to one, right down to the last chip and wire, using the same assembly methods as in the originals.

Chris, you are THE classic scanner expert and I have some questions for you:
-How many bulbs were used in the original scanner?
-Also, I've noticed in rewatching classic BSG the camera belt has a red bulb (or LED?) it would seem... am I right?

THANKS for any info you can share with us other "Tin Cans."

Post by **ChrisPappas** » Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:02 pm

There were 32 bulbs. The light on the belt was an amber neon indicator for the self-contained charger. It should not have been on while it was being worn.

There were also red and black banana jacks on the belt to tap into the power. Although it does not light, perhaps this is the red you saw?

Chris

YouTube · Post by **Cylon-Knight** » Sat Nov 21, 2009 9:09 pm

ChrisPappas wrote:There were 32 bulbs. The light on the belt was an amber neon indicator for the self-contained charger. It should not have been on while it was being worn.

There were also red and black banana jacks on the belt to tap into the power. Although it does not light, perhaps this is the red you saw?

Ahhh.... I have noticed the light "on" (as good as I can remember!). I'll rewatch the shows (love to find new excuses to re-watch them - HA). If I spot it again I'll post a pic. Maybe they had a belt that was "on the fritz" or something? --- eeek, me Cylon's busted! lol

The red - probably was just red - not a light. I think that was in G1980 where I clearly saw red - and Cy was in the sunlight a lot. I'll have to rewatch that too!

Thanks for the info Chris!!!

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